Living Reconciled
Living Reconciled, hosted by Mission Mississippi, is a podcast dedicated to exploring reconciliation and the Gospel that enables us to live it out. Mission Mississippi has been leading the way in racial reconciliation in Mississippi for 31 years. Our model is to bring people together to build relationships across racial lines so they can work together to better their communities. Our mission is to encourage and demonstrate grace in the Body of Christ across racial lines so that communities throughout Mississippi can see practical evidence of the gospel message.
Living Reconciled
EP. 88: Bishop Henry Joseph's Journey Through Addiction, Healing, And Reconciliation
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In this episode, Bishop Henry Joseph shares how two words—“It’s time”—transformed his life from gangs, addiction, and homelessness to healing, reconciliation, and mission. From Compton and Skid Row to Malawi and back to Jackson, Henry recounts his journey of radical obedience, global ministry, and building a multiracial church rooted in the gospel. Hear how faith carried him through loss, recovery, and calling—and why Jesus remains the center of true reconciliation.
Special thanks to our sponsors:
Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regions Foundation, Mississippi College, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State University, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Mr. Robert Ward, and Ms. Ann Winters.
This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated to giving our communities practical evidence of the gospel message by helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured for us by living with grace across racial lines.
SPEAKER_01:Hi, I'm Nettie Winters. I am your host today. Generally, you would have uh Brian Crawford and uh Austin Horror with me today, but my partners in crime are somewhere doing other excellent things in the Lord's name. And so I am solo this morning to host you on uh Living Reconcile broadcast here, a podcast here. I will get to my guest in just a moment. I'm ex I'm really excited about my guest. I've been knowing him for quite some time. He's a great man of God, and uh he has a story that needs to be told over and over again. So I'm I'm really looking forward to business with him and having a good time this morning, uh sharing with him as we uh do this this broadcast, podcast, not broadcast, podcast for Living Reconciled. But before we jump into that conversation, I want to take a moment to just give a big shout out to our sponsors, uh, those who make this podcast and the work of reconciliation across our state possible. We are grateful for partners like Me Sun, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, the Regents Foundation, Mississippi College, Pine Lake Church, Archer Church, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State University, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, uh, a Christian life church, along with friends like Doris Powell, Robert Ward, and Ann Winter, and others that help make our work possible. We just want to tell you how much we appreciate you because without you, we could not get this work done and take the message across uh the state of Mississippi and beyond. And so we can't say enough to tell you how much we thank you for what you're doing that. And if you'd like to join this incredible group of sponsors, you can do so by visiting missionmississippi.org. Click on the donate button, invest button at the top of the right of the page, and that will take you to our giving page where you can invest not only in this podcast, but also in the ongoing work of reconciliation happening across the state. All right, now let's get into today's conversation. My uh guest today is Bishop Henry Joseph. He is the illustrious pastor, lead pastor of New Horizon Church International. Uh Bishop, welcome to our program. We're excited you're with us today.
SPEAKER_00:Good morning. Good morning, Nettie Winners. It's it's great to be with you this morning.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I'm excited. So, you know, uh uh Henry, you know, I've been knowing you. I guess it's okay to call you Henry. I know you've been Bishop in the past. Yeah, so you know, I remember the days of of uh bringing promise keepers to Jackson and all of that. And so uh you got a great story though. Why don't you tell our audience a little bit about who Henry Joseph is?
SPEAKER_00:Well, again, thank you for the invitation this morning. It's great to be with you. Um yeah, as I told you before, you're sure you want me to shock your listeners with my story, but I'm always eager to share uh what God has done in my life.
SPEAKER_01:Um Yeah, I was I'm eager for you to share your story because you said a shock folks, but you know, I you know, God is in the business of shocking folks. God is in the business of transforming folks. So uh I think it'd be a great story for people to hear and to know about.
SPEAKER_00:Well, I was born uh in 1960 in in Compton, California. Um had a great family, had uh five other siblings. Um my mother had uh married uh for the second time after her first husband uh passed away in an industrial accident. She and him both were from Jackson, but my father was from New Orleans, and both of them had moved out to California just looking for that better life, uh better opportunities, and and quite honestly, escaping uh Jim Crow. Um I guess uh the most first significant thing after my birth was my uh father passed away when I was only 10 years old. He was an assistant pastor of a big Baptist church in uh in Los Angeles and left my mother uh with uh with four kids still at home, uh really fine. And she only had a 10th grade education. My dad had bought a brand new house, and my mother was uh was a housewife, so I'll never forget her getting a phone call one day. And she hung the phone up and she uh began to sing that old Negro spiritual uh the Lord will make a way somehow. Uh my mother was a great praying uh woman. And what had happened, she had just got hired as uh to Hughes helicopter uh or Hughes aircraft as an electronic assembler, which is a fancy term for her sitting down at a desk with a spool of soldering iron and a soldering iron and making circuit boards all day. But she uh took advantage of the training opportunities and kept moving up, moving up. And when she retired, uh just a testimony of how great she was, uh, when she retired, she was final inspector for radar systems for the space shuttle. A little 10th grade education from Jackson, Mississippi. But obviously she was a powerful woman and and a brilliant woman. But while she was working from 6 to 6, uh the streets were were raising me. Um I joined the gang probably when I was only 14, uh, began to dabble in drugs uh at 15, started selling at 16, uh went to jail for the first time uh at 18, uh got hooked on crack eventually at uh at 19. And um from there literally just traveled around the U.S. and was literally locked up in four different states. I've been to jail in four different states. I eventually settled in New Orleans, where I met my lovely wife, who I've been married to now for 40 years, by the grace of God. Uh, but I I still had a drug problem that eventually um led me to be homeless uh here in Jackson. As crazy as it sounds, I used to sleep in Battlefield Park. Um then I moved back to California, and I was homeless on Skid Row in downtown Los Angeles for over two years. And I was still hooked on crack, homeless, and now uh I was HIV positive. And I was I was just in bad shape. I was in bad shape. And uh one day in 1992, um I had an encounter with God in a crack motel. Uh I heard the voice of God, and that voice said two words. He said, It's time. And in those two prophetic words from the voice of God, I knew exactly what he was saying. Uh he was saying it's time to give me, to give your life to me, and I did. Uh I walked to the Long Beach Rescue Mission, and uh they knew me quite well because I was a regular client.
SPEAKER_01:Uh to the point when I asked when I asked the sound like a couple of when the principal knows your name.
SPEAKER_00:To the point when I asked the chaplain um that I wanted to join the program, he didn't think I was serious. Uh so he said, Well, I tell you what, you go out there and sit in the courtyard. Uh and if you're here tomorrow, uh I'm gonna let you in the program, a one-year, highly disciplined Christian rehab program. And as he was telling me that, I was uh scanning his bookcase, and I said, Well, if I gotta sit out here all day and all night, at least let me read a book. And one book really caught my eye, and it was called Born Again by Chuck Carlson. Turns out um I read that book, and based on his testimony, I made a real intelligent, intelligent, uh, intentional uh confession of my sins and putting my faith in Christ. Little did I know, uh two months later, after I get took me almost two, three months just to get sober, uh about two months in, I remembered I was HIV positive. And um, this was back in '92. And I eventually uh I went to get uh tested again so I could start treatment, uh, even though there was little treatment back then. Well, come to find out, the test came back a couple of weeks later, I was negative. And the Lord had told me I healed you. Uh when you gave me your life, uh I healed you of HIV. And that was 33 years ago. I'm still here, I'm still healthy, I'm still negative. Uh, but God did a miracle in my life. And I stayed in the program for 14 months, very disciplined, but I um God had given me a real passion for studying his word and praying and uh asking him to reconcile me with my wife, who I hadn't seen in three years, uh, but we had never divorced. And um after 10 months of fervent prayer, uh, we reconciled, and she came to my graduation. Um, they wanted to hire me as a chaplain. I was uh I did so well, but uh I wanted to come back to Jackson and uh be with my wife and uh start this new life. Um that's brought me to where I am today. So that's that's my first half of my life. And I'll let you ask some questions about this second half.
SPEAKER_01:You you know, that's an amazing story. And uh not only did God save you, but he healed you. And I don't know, I don't know, I don't know whether people are shocked because of the greatness of God, or it took you from, or you're saying it just, you know, your background and so forth. I think God just uh demonstrated through your life that uh nothing is impossible, all things are possible with him.
SPEAKER_00:I have uh when I was teaching one day uh in the pulpit, uh, and this happens to me sometimes, the Lord uh uh speak to me while I'm speaking to others. And and usually it's not even on the same subject. But um while I was teaching out of the clear blue sky, the Lord whispers to me and said, uh, you know why you didn't die when they were shooting at you in New Orleans? You know why you didn't die when they tried to stab you in that motel room? You know why you didn't die when that six foot four, three hundred-pound guy tried to hit you in the head with a baseball bat. The Lord said, Because you were a bishop. But you didn't know it. But I was protecting you as a man of God, even when you were homeless, HIV, positive, crackhead. And then when I had this call from God, I then stepped into who I already was, and everything that was not part of my calling had to fall off of me, including HIV. Um, and so that's how I survived uh the streets. God was protecting me because he knew I had a destiny, but I didn't become, this is crazy. I didn't become a bishop when Bishop Wellington Boone ordained me. I was called to be a bishop before the foundation of the world. And I just had to step into the reality that God already had for my life.
SPEAKER_01:Man, I noticed that that in your resume you have the word global ministry and faithful obedience. Talk a little bit about the the second half, as you say. Well, I know I noticed you did have a global, uh, what do you want to call it? A global crime streak or something?
SPEAKER_00:No, this is my post-crime criminal career.
SPEAKER_01:Um but after well, you know, you ain't gonna find that Apostle Paul was a jailbird.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but that's true too.
SPEAKER_01:For a different reason than you know.
SPEAKER_00:But um, yeah, so I I moved back to I moved back to Jackson in 1993, um, reconciled with my wife, and uh worked a secular job as a commercial artist uh for several years before uh I took my first mission trip. Uh uh eventually I was working at Gateway Rescue Mission. I was their program manager and eventually their director of development. Um, but while I was working there, uh I went on my first mission trip to Malawi, Africa with uh our sister church, which was uh Trinity Presbyterian Church when it existed. And that trip changed my life. Uh how so?
SPEAKER_01:I I hear people saying it often so give us a unfold that some more for us.
SPEAKER_00:Well, first, you know, when I stepped off the the airplane and I walked down this the gangway, uh the steps, I set one foot on the tarmac, and I had this supernatural experience, almost like something out of a science fiction movie, that something from the ground grabbed my leg and began to move all through my body. And I had this overwhelming sensation that I had come home. I had felt something that I didn't even feel at home, and that was the feeling of being home. Uh, and then it was just a great trip to Malawi at that time, it was uh one of the poorest countries uh in the world, literally. Uh most people made less than a dollar a day uh when I was uh going there. But I became really hooked on cross-cultural missions to the point I came back and appointed myself missions pastor. I didn't ask anybody, I just said this is what I would do. And uh I began to lead teams to uh sub-Saharan Africa every year, uh, particularly pastors who would uh help me do leadership training and pastoral training. Yes, sir.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so um then I was there on a trip in 2003, and this is amazing. I heard the Lord as clearly as I did the day I got saved in that crack motel. And what God told me while I was in Malawi, let me back up a little bit because it's kind of funny. So Pastor uh Robert McCullum from Priestley Chapel Baptist Church in Canton, Mississippi, was on this team. Uh I wasn't, I think I was just a minister, a licensed minister at the time. And uh so I'm letting the pastors uh talk to our uh elders from our host church who we had a partnership with, and I'm just sitting over in the corner taking notes on my laptop. And uh the question came up uh between those elders was how could we serve you in the upcoming year? And uh the host church said, Well, we've been without a pastor for two years. We've had an interim, but we're looking now for somebody more permanent. And they went down this long list of qualifications, uh, doctorate, 10 years experience, uh you know, having graduated from seminary, having pastored a cross-cultural church and done cross-cultural mission work in the past and going on and on. So when they said that, Robert McCullum turns around, almost turns his head all the way around. And if you know Robert McCullum, he's got a great sense of humor, so he makes a joke. He said, I thought I know it very well. Yeah, he said, Well, well, Henry, why don't you do it? And everybody started laughing, you know, it was a joke. But as soon as he finished uttering the sentence, the Holy Spirit rushed in that room and turned his joke into a prophecy. And at that moment, the Lord spoke to me and said, Go home, give away everything you own, and move you and your wife and your family to Malawi and minister my word and help my people. That was in November, uh, no, October of uh 20 uh 2003. Uh, we came right back. I came right back with my wife in December because she had never been there before. But let me back up again when I came home and I said, the Lord's calling us uh to move to Africa. Uh she was silent, and I said it again, and she started laughing. So I said it again, and she she uh she then knew I was serious. And she looked me in the eye and she started moving that head back and forth. She said, I'll see you when you get back.
SPEAKER_01:Had those kind of conversations before.
SPEAKER_00:But we prayed and and we fasted, and God confirmed the word. And within three months, we did exactly what he told us to do, and I was doing really good by then. Had four cars, uh, two businesses, both me and my wife had good jobs. Uh, we were getting by our dream house, and the Lord said, give it away. It was so strong, the voice and the instruction of the Lord, I couldn't pray about it. Because it was nothing to pray about. It was the issue, are you going to be obedient or not? And I always felt when in these callings that if I didn't do what God told me to do, I would put myself in my march of two thousand and four, we had moved um to Malawi. And that year, according to the CIA fact book, Malawi was the poorest country in the world. And uh I took over a church planted by Southern Baptists, which was still unusual in the heart of the capital of the city, very influential church. Uh, and it grew. We had over 42 nations represented in our congregation. And uh over seven years we grew from 300 to over a thousand people, and by the time I left, we were having uh five worship services in three different languages.
SPEAKER_01:Man, that that's an amazing story. So that was there was no apprehension or or or uh resistance from the church to say, you know, they laid aside their big resume requirements and things and hired you?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, there was this one elder, uh Willy Arritt. He was German, and he just he just knew very wasn't your typical German personality. He was very humble, very spiritual, uh, really loved the Lord. And the Lord must have spoken to him because he just advocated uh for me uh as one of the chief elders to be um the senior pastor of Capitol City Baptist Church. Because, as you just noted, that long list of uh requirements that they had, I could I couldn't tick one of the boxes.
SPEAKER_01:Well you not one where the safety says name.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's that's that's about the only thing I uh I could fill in. Everything else was blank. And uh but uh you know I had some great referral letters, you know, from Bishop Krude, uh from uh Steve Lanier, uh from Redeemer, uh, and a couple of other pastors, and everybody knew I were I was the person, even though I didn't have the qualifications, everybody knew it was a call from God.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, well when you put Goebbels ministry down there, I'm talking about it it stands out uh in in terms of that. It stands out uh as as it relates to that. Now, one time you had a newspaper called proclaim. How did that come about?
SPEAKER_00:That's a that was another great testimony. How did you name it proclaim? Well, that was another great uh testimony. Um yeah, so uh we were up near Meridian uh during a pastor's conference. Me and Bishop Krudep were teaching uh at a church, and something just unusual happened. This lady walked in boldly, had a camera in her hand, walked down the middle aisle while we're I'm literally teaching. She takes some photographs, she turns around, she leaves and comes back, and she puts some uh newspapers in the newspaper stand in the foyer. Um so I picked one up after uh after my session, and as soon as I picked the newspaper up, the Lord spoke to me again. He said, uh, I want you to start a newspaper and name it, proclaim, but start it when I tell you. Um so I held that word, and about a year and a half later, he said, Okay, it's time. And he gave me every detailed strategy of how to produce this Christian publication and uh that distributed in central Mississippi. And I did exactly what the Lord uh instructed, and we put out our first issue, and quite honestly, I made all my initial investment back in the first issue with profit, and uh it was uh it was very successful all the way up to when I moved to Malawi, and the Lord told me to give it away. And uh brother came to me and said the Lord spoke to him. So I literally gave the newspaper away, but it was uh it was probably the first black Christian publication in Mississippi, and it was very good.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I know. I used to subscribe to uh used to bring us uh the newspaper around the missionists at the office and uh stuff.
SPEAKER_00:Going back to uh you identifying my global ministry, so while I was in Malawi, and this is just still blows my mind. I thought I was just going to pastor this church and uh be a good under shepherd uh for the Lord, but it turns out he had much bigger uh ideas in ministry for me. Uh so I led a an orphan's ministry of over 600 children. I had a uh a national uh radio program that was heard throughout the country twice a week. Um probably the most powerful thing was uh uh planted churches, uh both in Malawi and Burundi, in Pakistan and South Africa, all as a result of being a missionary pastor in uh in Malawi. Also, uh while in Malawi, uh there was an executive team from the Luzon movement that came to our church, and I was preaching that day, and after service, they said, You're this kind of person uh that we want to attend Luzon because you you can only attend the Luzon conferences by invitation. Um and not only did they choose me to go, they gave me a scholarship, they flew me, put me in a four-star hotel. Uh, so I was able to participate in the Luzon Congress in Cape Town in 2010, and then uh I was uh nominated again, uh just uh I think it was 2024, uh for the Seoul Korea Luzon uh conference. Uh because they've only had four conferences in uh the 50-year history of the movement, and I've been blessed to be invited to two of them, which uh on average about 5,000 people from every single country in the world uh is in attendance. It's just a great, great evangelical movement. Oh I'm telling you all this, it's the boy from the neighborhood that God set up to do great things around the world.
SPEAKER_01:You know, working in global ministry like that and being a missionary pastor and so forth, but you know, mission mission is about getting people to live out the reconciliation in in Christ Jesus in a way that we cross those demarcations of race specifically as you know uh ethnicities and so forth. And so uh, how did all that work for you in terms of that, in terms of race relations? Well, these mixed audience and and uh how how did it tell me a little bit about that, how that works out.
SPEAKER_00:Well, I think uh again, as you know, I I I was on staff with Promise Keepers for uh I believe three, three years. Um I think Promise Keepers was a revival. I think it's probably the greatest reconciliation movement uh in America uh to date, uh particularly among Christians. And um I really learned a lot about reconciliation during those uh three years working under Coach uh uh McCartney. Uh I took those experiences uh to South Africa where I planted a church called Grace Church. And I'm when I was pastoring in South Africa, it was uh just a few years post uh apartheid. Uh and God had called me to be a reconciler uh because during the apartheid era, uh the church was um uh separated uh into real, real confined silos. You had the Dutch Reform, you had uh Assemblies of God, you had Baptists, but most of these denominations were birthed out of apartheid, meaning that whites and blacks and colors could not uh worship together. It was extremely rare and uh perilous, quite honestly. Uh, so a lot of these denominations are a result of uh of racial segregation, and God had called me to preach a message that would reconcile people to each other and to God.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you use the word black and colored in the same sense. What's the distinction there?
SPEAKER_00:Well, in South Africa, uh because of the legacy of apartheid, uh there were three major races or ethnic groups. Uh your white Africanas, your black, uh indigenous Africans, they hate being called indigenous, so I'm just using that as uh uh an informational term. And then you had colors uh who were uh mixed race, and uh during apartheid, those uh three ethnic groups were totally separated, uh even though uh the Africanas made up only thirteen, fourteen percent of the coun of the population, and this is still crazy. They had absolute control over the whole country. Physically, spiritually, mentally, economically, geographically, thirteen percent of the population had absolute control over the other eighty-five, somewhere around there. Um and the other uh eighty-five were blacks and colors. Actually, me and you would be considered colored because of our our lighter uh skin tone. Uh, we would be considered mixed race. But under apartheid, we would still uh be segregated and not have the privileges of the white Africanists.
unknown:Wow.
SPEAKER_01:You you you thoroughly have uh a great story and it's worth telling, and and I've learned a lot. I knew a lot about you. I knew most of your story. Uh I remember when you were doing the uh working with Mitch Mississippi here in Jackson to bring Promise Keepers here. We did that twice, and uh um I thought you were staying with with both Promise Keepers and Miss Mississippi in terms of that. I remember helping raise money.
SPEAKER_00:I love I love Mission Mississippi. You know, I was at the first rally at uh Memorial Stadium. I'll never forget uh Tom Skinner's message. Uh that uh how long ago was that? 30, 30 something years ago?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think this is our 33rd year. It was in 1993.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so I was I've been there from the beginning and uh always uh admired and loved the ministry of Mission Mississippi, and certainly it was needed, it's still needed, and has made a significant impact on the history of Mississippi.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, absolutely. And uh so moving moving towards, you know, you you've given us the first and second half. Is it not now? What do you call the the area you in now? What is what did your card face? Is this a third quarter?
SPEAKER_00:I'm headed into the fourth quarter now. Um I'm I'll be 65 in a few weeks. Um I've been a member.
SPEAKER_01:Did you skip the third quarter? I didn't hear about the second quarter.
SPEAKER_00:I'm kind of going in the third. I'm ending the third quarter now. Uh actually, the third quarter was the last five years, which were probably the toughest of my life. Uh the third quarter was tough. Uh I planted a church called Zion in uh Richland. Um and I signed the lease and paid that lease for a whole year, two weeks before the pandemic. Um given the landlord tens of thousands of dollars, thinking, okay, I have enough money to pay the lease for a year, that'd give me enough chance to build the church and uh and not have the pressure of having to pay uh the lease. Well, again, two weeks before the pandemic, and uh we couldn't get any traction. I mean, all of our evangelistic plans were scrapped. We couldn't go door to door. There were days we couldn't even have church. Uh and I lunched out with only five families. And um 18 months and$400,000 later, I had to close. Uh and even in that 18 months, I had a severe uh uh uh uh vehicle accident. I hit a tree at 70 miles an hour. Still don't know what happened. Um I got the scar on my forehead, peeled my forehead back to the skull, had uh two cracked ribs, bleeding on the brain, uh, and walked out the hospital in three days. Uh still don't even know how I survived. Uh also had a severe case of COVID. Uh me, my wife, my daughter, my mother-in-law, her son, his wife, their daughter, all of us had a severe case of COVID all at the same time. And because I had so many friends around the world, uh it was a traumatizing time when some of my closest friends were passing away. Uh then I had to close the church. I was uh broke, I was uh jobless. And uh yeah, it was that third quarter. That's why I'm maybe that's why I didn't want to mention it. It was uh it was uh some tough years, but I'm telling you, really tough, but I I I'm glad you asked me that because uh even after the accident, um I've been I had to do something that I've been teaching for years. Uh as I'm going through all these different traumas, uh the Lord said to me, Now you gotta do what you've been teaching others, that in the midst of your trials, you still gotta worship me. And I did. Uh when I had uh severe bouts of gout and had back uh slip discs in my back, all of this in five years, but I never lost my praise and I never lost my worship. And in the midst of pain, it still felt good to know that God is still good in the midst of trials, and that you still can give him praise and worship at difficult times in my life. So now I'm moving into the fourth quarter. I've been a member of uh New Horizon Church International for 33 years, walked out at rehab, moved to back to Jackson, and moved into that church as a member. Never in my wildest imagination did I think I would become a minister, and certainly a pastor, and you couldn't tell me I was gonna be a bishop, and then on top of that, that I would eventually become the senior pastor of New Horizon. Only God could do something like that.
SPEAKER_01:I said only God, but God, man. And so uh you never dreamt of that. I was just thinking about your your first two uh sharing with us about your first two phases uh of life, halftime and all of that. Is that in all of that, I know that where you are today was not an inkling of thought or anything like that. You know, tell us how that how did that take place? How did you get from planning a church that that you had to close, going back to Africa, and then coming back? We missed something in there. Fill in a little bit of that for us.
SPEAKER_00:Oh man, uh, first of all, in the midst of all of this, and I I wrote a letter to the elders in Bishop Crudep eight years ago. And in that letter, I stated that I felt the Lord was calling me to be uh the next pastor of New Horizon when Bishop Crudep uh would move to something else. Um and in that letter I said I'm gonna state this one time, but I'm never gonna bring it up again. But I just need to let you know that this is what I feel the Lord is is leading me to say. So I wrote that letter, still have that letter eight years later, but I carried that word, the word that I was going to be pastor uh of New Horizon one day. Uh me and my wife carried that word in simple obedience. Uh we didn't lobby people, we didn't go around saying, oh, I'm gonna be pastor one day. Uh we just kept it close to our hearts. And uh even when the Lord led us to move back to Africa about three years ago, uh, I was still uh questioning, you know, the word the Lord gave me. Uh and when I last thing I said to Bishop Crudup, I said, uh, he told me that he had chosen someone else. And I said, Well, you know, I'm always gonna be here for you. And probably one of the most sincerest, sincerest looks and responses I've ever gotten from Bishop Crudep. He looked me in the eye and he said, I know Henry. I know. And uh, when it didn't work out and uh in in in uh Malawi, I moved back to uh uh be the campus director for African Bible College in Le Longwe. Um huge responsibility. I was supervising 400 employees in this ministry. Uh thinking I'm gonna live in Malawi the whole rest of my life, even though I still got this word that I'm gonna be senior pastor. Well, God worked it where I only stayed four and a half months, uh, where something happened that was quite honestly very devastating to us, uh, me and my wife, because we thought we were coming out of this, you know, five-year trials, and uh by moving back to Africa, and instead of that being true, we were uh quite honestly, uh somebody hijacked my character, uh lied on me uh to the board of directors, and they didn't renew my contract. And how it happened was devastating. Uh devastating. But we came back uh to to Jackson. Uh the Lord told me to just wait on him and said very clearly, don't go get a job at Walmart. I know it's tough, but trust me, you've trusted me before, and I did. And with one foot off the cliff, he grabbed me again and saved me at the last moment. And um some of this I had to tell you in private, but um the day or the week before Bishop Krudep is sending out a letter announcing uh his choice for his successor, something happens where uh he changes his mind. And uh God changed his mind. He changed his mind, and I became the candidate, and uh even then I had to wait a year and a half uh before I took over, but I then I was patient. And uh sure enough, the word the Lord had given me eight years ago that I would be senior pastor has come to pass, and and church is doing great. We're researching, uh still committed to South Jackson. We're probably the biggest church in South Jackson right now. Um and uh things are going extremely well.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. You know, uh with a Mission Mississippi host, we're gonna ask this word about uh multi-part and multiracial congregations and things like that. And so how how are you moving it toward that area? Uh what's your vision or your passion for us?
SPEAKER_00:Well, we've always wanted to be. Uh we weren't as intentional as we could, but I see something happening that we're trying to seize the opportunity, and uh I hope nobody gets offended, but we've had several uh uh Cartesian uh people that have started coming to New Horizon, and their reasoning is that they don't feel like they're getting fed at uh their traditional churches. Um for some reason they like my preaching that yes.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I understand I I've I've heard you on many occasions and experience the power of God through you. So I I understand and appreciate their acclamation towards you in in terms of the church and what it's doing, but you you're you you God is doing it, as you know. Um I I think we need to probably put a bow on this. It's been great visiting with you and uh hearing your story. It's it's amazing. Um so you got uh a few minutes here that you can say to the audience. Uh uh, what would you like to say? What would you like them to remember beyond all the miracles, wonders, and signs God has done in your life thus far? What would you like to uh say to them as it relates to trusting God and being faithful?
SPEAKER_00:That's easy for me. Um you know, when I became a pastor, uh when you enter that office, you immediately feel uh a sense of power and influence. And you immediately know I can use this influence for my personal gain if if I really wanted to. But God never gave me that kind of personality or character. What he has given me, and uh I feel this is a true grace from God. I still see the gospel of Christ Jesus clearly, and I say that very intentionally because as I travel around the world, I meet different pastors. There are a lot of ministries that they're not preaching Jesus anymore. They don't see Jesus as clearly as they should. I've been blessed with a grace that I still see the gospel as preeminent and clear. Uh but with that grace comes a weight of responsibility, and that is I have to proclaim it. If I still see it clearly, I'm not uh contaminated with any other ambitions. I gotta preach that gospel, and I want to encourage the listeners to do the same. If you still see Jesus clearly, that is a grace from God, but it comes with a weight of responsibility. You gotta preach that gospel. Whether you're a layperson, a deacon, a minister, a pastor, a bishop, if you still see Jesus, preach Jesus and his preeminence, his redemption, and his return for his church. So thank you for allowing me to be with you this morning, Nettie. I pray that my testimony and my words have been a blessing uh to the listeners, and I've been greatly honored to spend time with you this morning.
SPEAKER_01:Same here. We appreciate you being here with us, and uh there's so much more for you to tell us. And and, you know, I don't know, uh I'm not the the chief head honcho here, but Brian Crawford is, and I'm sure that we will get another opportunity to share this time with you. Uh, thank you for uh sharing with us and being transparent in your in your sharing with us. Um I'm I'm just so um elated to have listened more deeply this time than I have in the past. And uh we thank you for your words, thank you for your encouragement, and thank you for being a partner. New Horizon International has been a partner with Miss Mississippi from the very beginning, continue to do that today. So we're excited about that. Bishop served on the original board. Uh Bishop Kruger did. And uh, as you were part of that church, you uh join in with us, bringing Promise Keepers to Mississippi a couple of times. And so we're excited about all of those things that uh we parted together with. Join us uh uh on any podcast network found uh platform you can find Living Reconcile and join us there. Uh God bless and God keep you. Thank you so much, Mitchell.
SPEAKER_00:You're welcome. God bless you. Bye-bye.
SPEAKER_02:Thanks for joining Living Reconciled. If you would like more information on how you can be a part of the ongoing work of helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured, please visit us online at missionistissippi.org or call us at 601-353-6477. Thanks again for listening.
