Living Reconciled
Living Reconciled, hosted by Mission Mississippi, is a podcast dedicated to exploring reconciliation and the Gospel that enables us to live it out. Mission Mississippi has been leading the way in racial reconciliation in Mississippi for 31 years. Our model is to bring people together to build relationships across racial lines so they can work together to better their communities. Our mission is to encourage and demonstrate grace in the Body of Christ across racial lines so that communities throughout Mississippi can see practical evidence of the gospel message.
Living Reconciled
EP. 87: From Foster Care to CASA with Samantha Kalahar
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What difference can one steady adult make in a child’s life? In this episode, Samantha Kalahar, Executive Director of CASA of Hinds County, shares how Court Appointed Special Advocates bring hope and truth to vulnerable children in Mississippi’s court system.
Hear her powerful story from foster care to advocacy—and learn how small acts of presence can change a child’s future.
🎧 Listen now and visit casaofhindscounty.org or missionmississippi.org to get involved.
Special thanks to our sponsors:
Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regions Foundation, Mississippi College, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State University, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Mr. Robert Ward, and Ms. Ann Winters.
This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated to giving our communities practical evidence of the gospel message by helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured for us by living with grace across racial lines. Hey, thanks so much for joining us for episode 87 of Living Reconcile Podcast. I'm your host, Brian Crawford, with my good friend and co-host, Nettie Winter. Sir, how are you doing today?
SPEAKER_04:I'm wonderful. How are you doing? I'm excited about this podcast.
SPEAKER_07:I'm really excited about this podcast. We got an incredible guest. We have an incredible guest. But before we get to our guests, I want to uh give a quick shout out to a couple of our sponsors, folks like Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regis Foundation, Mississippi College, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Pine Lake Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Robert Ward, and Winners, folks that have been so generous and so gracious to us, it's because of all of your generosity that we're able to do what we do. And what we do is the work of reconciliation all over the state of Mississippi and create podcasts and content like this podcast. If you would like to join this illustrious list of sponsors, you can do so by visiting missionmississippy.org. Click on the donate invest button. It's typically at the top right side of the screen. And you two can join that list of reconcilers, peacemakers, bridge builders who have and join who have joined us in this very important work of Living Reconciled. We have an incredible guest today. And we started, we we started out as just simply neighbors. And because we because we work in the same building, Jackson Leadership Foundation, the 236th place uh here in on 236 East Capitol Street in Jackson has brought together a lot of incredible people. And um and so we have been brought together as a result of this uh this wonderful venture that Jackson Leadership, Jackson Leadership Foundation is embarking on. Um but our guest is the executive director of CASA of Hines County, and you will learn about CASA in just a moment. Um, but she is a believer, a woman of faith. She is uh a woman whose reputation precedes her as it relates to her passion uh for children and advocacy, advocating for uh children and ensuring uh their safety, ensuring they're flourishing. And we are incredibly, incredibly excited and delighted to have um our um our resident, our resident friend, our neighbor, um, and an incredible believer uh with us, uh Samantha Kallahar. Samantha, how are you doing, man?
SPEAKER_03:I'm I'm great. I'm so excited to be here. And um, like you said, I've gotten to know you, be neighbors, and uh, Mr. Winters, I've heard of your reputation for years, and so I'm delighted to be you know in in such great company today.
SPEAKER_04:Well, I'm delighted to be with you as well. Now, that was a gentleman I used to work with at NCUA named Color Hart. Is that uh a relative of yours? That's a matter of credit union association or something like that.
SPEAKER_03:My um father-in-law is on the board of the credit union, yes. Wow.
SPEAKER_07:Wow. Small world indeed. Yeah, small world indeed. It's really not that small. Nettie just happens to know everybody, Samantha. You'll learn that about Nettie. You'll learn that about him. But why don't we learn that? Allowing you to tell us a little bit about CASA. What is CASA so that that can shake the rest of our dialogue over the course of this episode?
SPEAKER_03:That's great. So CASA stands for Court Appointed Special Advocate. Um we are asked to come into the court by the judge, the youth court judge, um, and to work on the cases that she assigns to us in in Heinz County. That's Judge Carlin Hicks. Um, she assigns cases to our advocates, and I'll explain the advocates in a moment, um, so that she can get more information on the case, more objective information from a neutral source, so that when she has to make a determination on how to rule in a child's life and what to do in deciding their futures, that she has as much information in front of her as possible. Um, as much information from someone who is solely there just to advocate for what's in the best interest of a child, not because there's um uh they're being paid to do that, which there's some wonderful people being paid to do social work and do that. They have a lot of caseloads, they have a lot of things. Um this person just has no vested interest personally other than that child, um, and making sure that child ends up in the best place that they can. Um so that's a big task. Um, that's a big, a big ask. But if you think about what a youth court judge does on a daily basis, all day, every day, sitting there making life-altering decisions for children and families, um it's it's really awesome when a judge seeks out a CASA and says, Hey, give me all the information so I can make the best decisions possible.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, that that's incredible. That's incredible. And and of course, you know, learning a little bit about your story, you bring a very unique perspective to this work, uh, having having been through uh, so to speak, some of the some of the you know, some of the peaks, valleys, highs, lows, good and bad of the system in and of itself. And so you bring a pretty powerful perspective to the work. Um so having experienced the foster care system, you know, firsthand, how has that uniquely shaped your heart? And how has that uniquely shaped your calling to this work?
SPEAKER_03:You know, I think there's so many ways. Um, you know, I I grew up um in a very dysfunctional family. Um my mother had me by the time she was 16, and by the time she was 21, there were five of us. Um and so, you know, it started off very rocky and very unstable. Um, we bounced through relatives and we ended up homeless, living in homeless shelters, living in tents on a river. I mean, we we were at rock bottom for much of my childhood. Um, and at some point we I got put into the the foster care system. Um and so having that experience and kind of knowing what it's like to feel helpless, to feel hopeless, to feel like nobody cares, um, and there's there's no path for your future, you know, it it it really kind of hits. Um but as a grown person now who's been through that and and many more things, foster care and aging out of foster care, I look back at the people at different points in my life who stepped in, who maybe in little ways stepped in or in big ways. Um I'll give you an example when I was um 14, 15, around there, I remember thinking nobody has kids because they want to. Every child I knew was an accident or unintended, or and I remember meeting a woman who had prayed for her children and wanted her children, and and that was a reality shift for me to know that there were parents who actually planned and wanted their children, not just kind of ended up with them from choices that they'd made, that shifted my reality. And so somebody stepping in with a little different perspective and sharing that with me and speaking into my life shifted my mind a little bit. Um, I can say, you know, I met my foster parents who became my parents, who are now my kids' grandparents, um, and just seeing how hard she fought for her children. My oldest foster brother has cerebral palsy and he's handicapped. And a f my foster mom, who's now my mom, um, dedicated everything she could to being a good mom and getting him what he needed. And it took seeing these types of people who walked in faith, these types of people who showed their faith in their deeds and who spoke into my life to really change my reality from the reality that I had to that point of children are a burden, you know, nobody wants children. Um there's there's no hope, you know, we're you know, to seeing people who just kind of spoke into life. And I tell people it doesn't have to be the biggest thing in the world, it could be that little as really just sitting down and and sharing that faith with someone and explaining, you know, why you show up every day for your child, why you do this, to help somebody understand that that the reality they're living in isn't the only reality. And so when you have a foster kid who's lived in traumatic and disruptive and unhealthy settings, having an adult who finally comes in and says, Okay, tell me what you need, you know, and and listens and shows up and comes back and follows through on what they say they're gonna do, it can change the reality of how a child perceives the world. Um and so that's a pretty big calling. I know that sounds very, very big, but that that consistency of a caring adult can mean the difference between a child believing in their future and not really seeing anything different than what they've known their whole life.
SPEAKER_04:That that's amazing, uh Samantha. Uh I was listening to K Love today and the and the and the the uh DJ was having people to call in and talk about a moment in their lives where someone said something or being a friend, uh that and a lady called in and she said, Were you the DJ from some other radio station that she used to listen to? And he said, Yeah, she said, you know, you don't know this, but I was at a gas station pumping gas, and I was 19 years old, and I was getting ready to put my baby up for adoption. And you and your wife were celebrating the expectancy of a and you just found out that you're gonna have a son and that you could hear the you could put the thing there, hear the breathing, and you got really emotional about that. But that changed the whole perspective of my life. I did not put my daughter up for adoption. I raised her, and then she went on to talk about how wonderfully she had been blessed, and then a part of that. On Sunday, my pastor preached, and I'm I don't know where I'm going with this, but anyway, my pastor preached about how we're so I guess the word is ingratitude rather than being grateful. We're not grateful. We take a whole lot of things for granted. And some of the things you just described, most of the people I know take for granted. Mother warning that planning, you know, to just, you know, looking forward to, excited, celebrating, no accidents, no unexpected, you know, that just a lot of people just take that so much for granted. And for you, I can see that it it affects you emotionally, but for you to be called to that and uh inspired from what you've gone through, your story, that's just something amazing to me. I just wanted to uh say that. I don't know, you know, it's just it it it it it almost getting me emotional now. I'm just um I'm thinking about uh uh so often how one word, one challenge from from people. We don't even know that we're uh speaking to someone and and and and what we say is projected. And I know your story today. It's an amazing story, and there are people out there that's connecting that otherwise would not be connected when they hear your story. Thank you for being here. I am really excited about this podcast.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, it's amazing. I appreciate that. It's amazing. Samantha, if if you don't mind, talk to us a little bit about how your your story um moved from just simply, hey, I'm excited. I have a testimony of surviving this system and thriving and and getting, you know, coming, coming in but going out, um, thriving, to I want to be a part of it. I want to assume leadership in and and help frame the structure of the system and take on this role of executive director. How how did you move from just simply saying, all right, this was great, you know, and the Lord granted me grace, and I got out not unscathed, so to speak, but I got out thriving. How did you go from that to saying, man, no, I want to be a part of this system long term and creating change for other children that's coming behind me?
SPEAKER_04:Brian, if I might add, an incredible, critical part of the process. It's not being a part of you're critical to helping these children get the start or get the recognition of getting where they need to be in the best interest of most of these courts and things, they make those decisions, and many times it's not in the best interest of the children. So speak to us.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I'll tell you, so I had the blessing of getting an academic scholarship to Mississippi State, and I lived in Nevada.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, um, go down Hill State.
SPEAKER_05:The checks in the mail, Samantha. The checks are the mail. Continue, continue.
SPEAKER_03:Um but I was blessed to to get a scholarship to go to Mississippi State. Um, and you know, I college was only gonna happen if if the doors opened for me. And I originally intended to be a math teacher. I was gonna be a math teacher, and that's what I went to study. And God opened the doors and closed some doors on calculus and and things like that. And and I ended up in social work, and I knew I never wanted to do casework. I was uh, you know, I I like strategy. I'm a I'm a big picture person. I love that. Um, and I also just what my heart wasn't really settled with doing child welfare. So I got my degree and and I did public health for about um 12 years, um, working on um public health issues, infant mortality and tobacco and a lot of those things. Um and spent a lot of time learning nonprofits, learning fundraising. If you're in nonprofits, you learn fundraising, no matter what your job title is. Um and doing all of that.
SPEAKER_06:Yes, you do.
SPEAKER_03:There was an opportunity to serve at Methodist Children's Home. And I thought, okay, I've learned a lot in my professional life. What if I marry that with my personal life and and come come together and do that? And so I was blessed to serve with Methodist Children's Homes for several years and and really grow um an understanding of the system and what it looks like in Mississippi and what it looks like now, because obviously I'm a little older than um than 18, so it's been a minute since I was in custody. Um, and so I've done that. And then I moved into doing policy work and working on um changing some of our laws and building a scholarship so our foster kids could go to college and and running a youth voice program with with other youth who had been in foster care and and doing policy work. Um and had some some really good things happen for Mississippi. This opportunity was taking all of that big picture work at Costa and going into one courtroom and making sure that it all got boiled down to one child at a time and one child at a time getting all of this work actualized in their life. Um and what I'll say before I go on with that is I spent 12 years doing child or public health. I spent a lot of time making sure I was healed, that I was stepping away from labels, that I wasn't Samantha the foster kid, the poor foster kid. I became a young professional. I became and figured out who I was as a person without all of the labels and all of the stigmas and and started a family and did that. And I think after a time it felt right. And God led me back to this work when I felt healed, when I felt like I had processed what I'd been to so that I could move on and be a part of working with other people. And I think that's really important. I work with a lot of young people who are aging out of the foster care system, and quite often many of them will tell you that I've told them go figure out who you are. And God will send you where you're supposed to be. But right now, your whole identity is labels that other people have given you, or how you fit in families that maybe let you down. And so I think one of the key things that helps me to do this work was I took the time to make sure I was healed, the time to make sure that I had processed my traumas before I went on trying to work on somebody else's traumas. You know, as they say, when you fly, you know, put the mask on yourself first before you help others. And so I think that's really key. Um, and as we recruit advocates for this work, we ask those questions too. A lot of people come at this work with their heart just wide open, but sometimes it's not the right timing. Um, and sometimes this work can be traumatizing to those of us. And everybody has a story. Mine happens to be through foster care. There's a lot of stories that people bring, but making sure that you understand who you are, understand where your limitations are, where your triggers are, understanding what God's calling you to is so key to being effective in this work. Um, and so that's one of the biggest things as I work with young people or I work with people who want to do this work, is making sure it's the right time for them and that it's the right calling. Um, so that you're able to show up fully for that child.
SPEAKER_04:So you you know, Samantha, you talk about making sure that I was healed, making sure that I know who I am. Is it is it is it is can you give us a glimpse of how it looked in the back room to walk that that that that that journey to making sure that uh if some of the listening audience now is is is just want to get healed. In fact, and I we got a lot of people out there that needs this. So give us a picture of uh of those steps, uh if that's possible, of what you did to do that, so people have a picture of what to do, how to do it.
SPEAKER_03:Wow, I wish there was a clear roadmap on that.
SPEAKER_04:Um don't we all?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, there's a lot of pithall pitfalls I stepped into. But I remember as I was aging out, there were times when I reached out to my biological family and thought, okay, I'm a grown person now. I'm gonna come at this and they can't hurt me. You know, I'm I'm grown and I know, you know. You still have those things and you still have to reconcile your relationships. Um, you have to determine if relationships are for your betterment or if they're for your harm. And, you know, how how does that add to um that? And I'll say one of the things that that makes you do that really well is when you have children and you look at who you're going to allow into their lives and making sure that they're going to be um people who speak into your children's lives. Um, I think that was really key as well. Um, but I also let go of some of the hurt. I also understood, you know, as I shared when I came on, my mom was 16 when she had me. She was a child having children, you know, and you get that perspective also and that empathy of understanding. At the time, you think your parents are supposed to know everything and that they're fully grown and they're right. She was a kid raising kids and and without a support system. And so you look at those things, but I also surrounded myself with people, foster parents, and and people who were who showed me what love was and were there for me and and really kind of changed that reality of this is what a family can look like. Um, I'll give you a quick example. I love this story because it was so just touching. I worked with a young lady, and unfortunately she's past, but one of my first foster kids that that I got really close with, um, she came to my house one one day for dinner and was eating with my family. And first of all, we sat at the table and and ate together, and I got out a gallon of milk and put it on the table. And she just started laughing. And I said, Yeah, you thought it was just on TV, right? Like I remember thinking, people don't sit at the table, they don't drink milk with their dinner, and and and I knew when she started laughing exactly what she was processing.
SPEAKER_06:Wow.
SPEAKER_03:That these things that were never part of our lives growing up, like we just thought, oh, that's how TV, you know, that's how the writers write it. And those types of things, I think, are a part of that healing process. If you've only known one thing, that's all you can know until somebody exposes you to a different reality of what your life could look like. And I will say my healing came by other people stepping in. My foster parents, um, wow, they changed my family tree, is what I like to say. Um and I didn't just get foster parents, I got brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles. Thanksgiving. We'll have 40 people here, and I'm only biologically related to my daughters. Exactly. Yes, yes.
SPEAKER_04:Let's make it part of a new addition. Let's make it 41.
SPEAKER_05:A new addition. A new addition to the family.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_07:Oh my goodness. Yeah. Yeah. That that's you know what you said, Samantha, stands out, resonates so so deeply with me. We we talk a lot about in our in our in some of the coaching and training that we do. We talk about moving from a posture of apathy to empathy in order to develop deep relationships across divides. And but but one of the dangers of empathy um is to is to have you know this what they what they call you know this kind of this narrow type of empathy that's built out of your own story that causes you to almost in some ways place you're place too much of yourself in someone else's story. And when you do that, then they they talk about this ideal of introducing a second a second form of trauma in the midst of the trauma, which is compassion fatigue, right? You know, you're you're so invested that you overinvest and you can't and you can't even be present with the people that you're trying to invest in, or you possibly project your story into the story. So when you so when something happens to that person, you're not feeling it from their vantage point, you're feeling it only from your vantage point, and what you might be feeling and and what you might be discerning might not even be happening to that person, but you're reliving your own story that you haven't done the work to actually work through and repair and bring healing. And so, and so a lot of times you can, like you said, you can go with that with that open heart, but that open heart can also be a bleeding heart that's bleeding out if we're if we're if we're not careful. And so, man, it's it's in it's incredible just to hear your wisdom kind of navigating through that and processing when when to step into a space like this and do that work and making sure that there's been some healing happening um before before you just you know thrust yourself into it. Um you talked about that young child that that was in your house and and the light switch came on, so to speak, and and the chuckle came out. Can you share uh some other stories that kind of capture what happens when when a child in in the system has someone that is finally consistently showing up for them through through the work that you guys are doing? Can you just share a story, obviously anonymously, and uh, but could you share a story that helps us helps us all get a picture and helps our listeners get a picture for what happens to a child when they get somebody that shows up and just starts consistently uh loving them well?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Well, so Casa of Heinz County, we're in our third year. Um, so we're we're we're a baby organization. Um there's 940 CASA across the country. And so um, you know, as as we look at our legacy, we're still building our legacy and we're still building those moments um here in Heinz County. But I can tell you, you know, I've worked with families that were fostering um and they had a teenager and they're like, I don't know what to do. You just keep showing up. You aren't gonna be perfect. You, you know, I would tell my foster parents, I just need to know that every time I mess up, I'm not gonna end up losing the connection, you know. Um so what's important about a CASA um is every month you show up. That child may have messed up that month, they may have just totally just wrecked everything. They have a new placement, they have a new, you know, they may have gotten moved around, but that doesn't matter. You know, you're there for that that child regardless of what they're going through. And that consistency of someone who just keeps showing up is so big. Um, when I first started working in child welfare, I remember one young lady, you know, I was I was meeting her for the first time, and I say she was trying to shock an army. She was telling me outlandish things and all the, you know, I was like, okay. She wanted to see if I would reject her from the beginning. She wanted to see how safe I was. You know, like, could she tell me things, or was I gonna be another person who was going to think she wasn't worth it?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Um, and so a lot of times when advocates are coming in, or you know, and this there's a lot of people who work in child welfare, you know, we specifically work with advocates who are volunteers who show up to do this work, but that consistency of knowing that you don't have to be perfect as a child to have someone show up and be there is is really important. Um, as we worked on policy efforts over the past couple of years, I sat in a legislative hearing where we were working on a scholarship and I had young people with me who were fighting for that scholarship. And to have a legislator stand there and say, these kids deserve the opportunities that our kids have, these kids deserve to they started one young lady started tearing up because to have somebody in that setting stand up and say she deserved all that touched her. You know, like there weren't very many people who say she's deserved much. You know, she wasn't a perfect kid, she was a kid. And so that type of thing, you know, I know when I was going through foster care, just knowing that my parents were gonna be my parents no matter what, um, was a big deal. And so that consistency, that knowing that you belong somewhere, and that even if you mess up, somebody's gonna stand up and say, she still deserves a happy home. Um, she deserves this. Giving a voice to that child when everybody else in there is just worried about what they're supposed to be. I remember, oh my gosh, I remember feeling like I was owned by my parents. They would decide whether they wanted me or not. Um and I didn't get a say in it. They could say, Oh, well, we don't, you know, we we don't have space for you, or there's, you know, and just feeling like, do I ever get to say where I should. be or what should happen in my life. And I know, you know, kids don't have all their understanding, but you know, they'll say that you remember how they won't remember what you said, but they'll remember how you made them feel. That's what it boils down to. You don't always have the perfect words. You don't always have, you know, all of the insight. You don't even know what to say in some situations, but you keep showing up and you keep saying you're important and you have a right, you know, to be happy. I think that's that's the biggest thing, you know, that I think we're asking for advocates to do. There's no perfect person. And the I will say certainly no perfect scared, right? Right. I've told my children, I'm gonna let you down. I love you more than anything in the world and I'd do anything for you. But I'm gonna mess up and I'm gonna let you down. Because everybody is flawed. And we just have to know your intent and where your heart is to really kind of be able to do that. But um yeah I think that's why the biggest core um thing that we tell people when they sign up to be an advocate is it's a commitment. You are committing to be with this child no matter the ups and downs. Like you're committed to be there and to show up. That child I have worked with kids have a 40 placements that's 40 people places entities that said we don't want you at some point you quit feeling because you just can't feel that over and over and over again.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah you you you you you you grow numb just to protect yourself you know you grow numb just to protect yourself.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah I tell people if a kid cusses you out or acts out at least there's still feeling at least there's still have an emotion so you can still get there.
SPEAKER_04:You can point to that one that you talk about 40 different places. You know sometimes I wonder uh as a pastor for many years I had to help foster parents and others and and guardians and so forth. And I just think about all the ones that didn't get to somebody like you or the 40 rejections and and then we wonder sometimes why kids and and people commit suicide or do harm themselves and other things. At some point it's like it it doesn't matter. It just but you know I I'm I'm I missed somewhere in here I missed your connection directly with the kids and and and you being an advocate to the court uh on behalf of the children giving them research and so forth. So you actually are able to bring kids into your care or are you help others prepare to bring them into the care help me understand that part of it a little bit more.
SPEAKER_03:That's a great question. So we do not take custody of of the children these children are in foster care so they're in foster homes and we are asked to join the case um and authorized by the court to do so um we we get that a couple of different ways we have foster parents who call and say hey we'd love to have a CASA on our case um we a youth can request us or a caseworker can request us or the judge can look at a case and say man I really need a little bit more I need more eyeballs on this case I need more insight um and what we do is we train individuals from the community and teach them how what to look for what what to um how to show up who to talk to who they should be asking questions of and then we walk alongside them as they monthly visit with the kids learn about the case they'll go talk to their teachers if they if they need to um talk to their foster parents and their bioparents and really get a good picture of what's going on in that child's life and also listen to that child. And then take all this information to the judge and give her a full picture of what's going on so that when she makes her decisions on whether that child stays in that foster home or that child goes home or that child um needs extra services that there's someone who has given her a really deep understanding of what is going on in that child's life.
SPEAKER_04:Is there a place in what you do where you work directly with the um parent and the child before they get into the foster system do do you have any interaction there?
SPEAKER_03:And if so how do you get the parent and the child into the therapy or what is there some process of when when the parent well I'm broken my kids broken so we need help how how do we get that help that's a lot yeah so no this is this is great questions we come in we were working on some cases before the children were removed trying to keep them together um right now we're working on cases where the children have already been removed um the goal always starts out unless there's extenuating circumstances the goal always starts out at putting the family back together unless somebody has done something grievous to that child and does not need to ever have that child in their custody again the goal is to put the family unit back together. And that is what we work for until it is determined by the court that that is just not going to happen or not possible. And so part of that is working with that motherfather grandmother and that system to say what services does the whole family need. And a lot of times it is therapy or services. Sometimes the parents need supportive services and we make those recommendations um sometimes the family unit needs you know some things or um if some services were brought into this home this family could be put back together. And that's the goal unfortunately we're not going to solve poverty we're not gonna solve you know all of the ills of society but we're gonna work within society and help to help families stand up as much as they can um but we will also say at some point if if a parent isn't doing anything to get their child back, is not you know working towards um making sure that that can be a safe home for that child, there's times where we have to say that as well you know because at some point that child is a whole being in themselves and deserves to start making connections with someone who will put their safety first, who will look into their future with them and who will give them that stability so that they can grow up and be kids at this time. So yeah and what I'll say a big thing that we get asked is well do I have to have any background well you probably need a clean background we need you to pass a background check. But you don't have to have a background to be a parent you know it's it's not like we're just looking for social workers.
SPEAKER_04:We're looking for someone who will fight for a child that could be an engineer it could be a waitress it could be a retired person it could be you know whoever it's just that heart and someone who will stand up and say this child deserves XYZ is there a form of process by which the the the prospective advocate of prospective parent or something do we have to go through a legal process you know Judge Bean got me involved in in some of this work and I might have met you during that time you know that uh I know her very well I know her dad as well yeah you know well I traveled around a few places she had me speaking and and and she was trying to get into the youth courts and things and those people that make those decisions and and things and uh I I I really got into that because I thought wow these children need to be together.
SPEAKER_03:Her goal whole goal was to keep the family together and uh we would meet with these advocates in the court system and so forth but I think I remember some kind of formal process they put people through is that some part of what Castor does most definitely um what we start out by you know people applying expressing interest on our website or or to us personally we go through an interview process we're gonna ask you some of those questions that I talked about at the very beginning about you know what brings you to this you know do you have experience with the foster care system? Do you have how have you resolved any of those things that you've faced you know we're gonna we're gonna want to ask those questions and they may be tough but we're looking for someone who's ready to worry about this child's trauma and isn't carrying you know all of their trauma into this as well um so we do a a pretty extensive interview at the beginning and just really get to know the person make sure they have a full understanding of what they're walking into as well as that they're ready for it and and and things like that. And then we actually have them come to court and observe court one day and see what it's like. And I will tell you that's been real eye-opening for a lot of people especially people who maybe um have grown up with with less disruption or I mean honestly we we should use the word privilege you know the privilege of of a solid family of of you know kind of that consistency seeing others and and what they may face in court sometimes is very eye-opening and takes a little bit of time to digest and and determine if that's something they can walk into um and so we do that and after each of these we we debrief with with the person and then if they're still interested which which many are um we go through 30 hours of training with them explain you know what to look for what are um what is child welfare what are the priorities how do we how do we look at a case um you know we're not Mississippi has a tradition of taking children for poverty and removing them from their homes um when you look at in in Mississippi 70% of the children in custody are there for neglect um neglect is a very open term and neglect had been broadly used for those that are impoverished and so taking people's children because they were in poverty a few years ago we worked to change the state law um to define neglect as willful neglect so you've been offered resources you've been offered services and you're denying them you're choosing to leave your children under resourced and uncared for which that's more active rather than being someone who's trying their best and you know it's not a level playing field out there. Right and so you know we have to talk through those things as well you know just because you may have more resources than this person doesn't mean that they don't love their children as much and that they shouldn't have their children if they can keep them safe and raise them um you know with with safety and security and love. And so a lot of those concepts are in that training making sure that people understand the goal is is to reunify a family until that becomes evident that it's not possible and those types of things. And so there's a lot of training and it's very interactive it's it's not just being spoken at it's it's really interactive understanding the cases and then after that you know you get sworn in by the judge and we assign you a case um and we walk with you every step of that um you have a supervisor who works with you monthly and and checks in on you and is your sounding board as you're looking at the case and you're you know kind of digesting it and then determining what your recommendations are. So it's it's a very supported um system but it's um it really takes someone who can look at a situation and and really kind of weed down to what will serve this child best in the long term. That's exciting to notice the advocate has an advocate yeah it's incredible it's incredible you mentioned in your bio uh say uh Samantha that um an adult who fights for a foster child shows the love of the Lord when you say that it's obvious that you have in mind well at least it's obvious to me reading that that you have in mind that this work is an outpouring and a reflection of of a person's love of God and a person's faith in Christ um how how how would you say you know talk and talk to that a little bit and speak into that a little bit more how does your faith guide the way you lead out in this work and guide the way you serve children in this work yeah well ironically um Sunday at church the the pastor spoke on this and and talked about you know Joseph and how all the things that happened in Joseph's life were meant for for ill will and yeah it was all ultimately for the betterment of so many people including Joseph at the end you know when when he was able to help so many others and things so we we look at these situations and we think why why does this even exist first of all but it also gives an opportunity for us to shine a light into that situation and help somebody understand that today in our lives is just a blip on a timeline it's not the entirety of our lives but if you've never seen anything different than what you're living in now you don't have that understanding of what hope can look like or what future can look like and so somebody coming in and showing that love showing that there are people who care that there are people who show up and and are consistent and that do what they say that shows a whole new reality to someone who may not be experiencing that. And many of our people come at that from their faith story and their understanding of God's love and how God has spoken into us when each one of us is flawed and each one of us is imperfect. So we're not you know we're showing that love it to imperfect people which are all of us in imperfect times and showing that their imperfect lives may just be exactly where God is is is moving them. I remember growing up talking to God so many times and I remember a few times saying okay God I know you're building character but can I use the character you've built for a little bit can you can you let me practice you know and then we'll add on some more character. But you know understanding that we don't all we aren't in control of the situation all the time but we're in control of how we approach it and what we show to other people during those situations I think is really that's one of the hard ways of of of showing your faith you know it's um but it I think hope is what you know and and he brought up Judge Beam and and you know she um was leading the the hope project and and that's one of the biggest things as you go through really dark times like being in foster care where you're taken from your friends your family your school your home your pets all of your toys maybe your room if that was a safe space you're taken from everything you know and put with strangers and put in a whole new world but having hope that your future can be better and that there can be happiness or that you can even find someone who can walk with you while it's still dark into that happiness I I think is it saved me. It saved me from being just hopeless and not seeing where I could be and I'll tell you you know I had not the best childhood ended up in foster care aged out I have two beautiful daughters three beautiful stepsons they're all they've never been hungry a day in their lives they've never worried that they weren't loved or that they weren't cared for and it took somebody stepping into my life changing my family tree and giving me that stability and that consistency of a loving person and it's changed my family tree. My kids will never know what it was like to grow up the way I did and that was the goal.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah I I love I love when you you know just that that statement that you make changing your family tree that is man there's so much light and so much hope uh and so much life in in those words they're incredibly powerful. I know you're a busy woman so we're gonna try to uh put a bow on this and wrap up but um I I got I got two final questions for you the first one is is uh I guess uh more I don't I don't know if it might be challenges that but but let me ask it this way there you know there's so many stigmas and so many um um preconceived notions misconceptions about uh uh children about this space about this line of work um what do you perceive to be based on your experience the the the biggest misconception the biggest thing that we get wrong when we're looking from the outside into this work what what what is the biggest thing that we seem to get wrong around this work my answer may surprise you um I've worked with a lot of foster kids and myself in foster care my experience as a blonde white young woman in the foster care system was different than the experiences of young African American males or even females or others of color there there's definitely a disparity in how kids navigate the foster care system based on ethnic and racial and and those types of of factors you know the youth I work with we had a very diverse group of young people and they would recognize that you know that um you know statistics will show us that a young African American male um their chances of finding a forever home are a fraction of that of a young Caucasian or even a a male Caucasian there's so many stigmas that go along with um with that um and you know it's easy to say we can't talk about that but those those that data that reality that experience I have young men who I've worked with who shared their stories and I know that wouldn't have happened to me I know that you know those experiences are very different and we have to be honest about that I know that's really even harder you know as as our times are changing to have those discussions but I think we need people who will stand up and not just the cute adorable foster kids but the ones that are mad because they have a reason to be mad.
SPEAKER_03:The ones that are broken because they've been broken and still see value in those young people and still come and advocate that that person deserves the same outcome. I'll say it's a priority for us to get good advocates from everywhere. But if I had African American American male advocates who could walk with a young African American male foster kid that that goes a long way in that connection and seeing someone that looks like me and walks like me who has this type of future you know it it gives a pathway. So I think that's definitely something that that plays into this. And when we look at Heinz County I I don't have the exact numbers but about 90% of our children are of color um and so making sure that we are being sensitive to the cultural and ethnic undertones of what that means you know and and what that um means for who we have as advocates what role models we're putting in front of them so that they can see themselves you know as as someone who is overcoming and and successful as well. So I I think that's one of the harder discussions to have about foster care in you know in many other areas of society, but definitely young children and and how they navigate the foster care system is deeply impacted by that.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah yeah well no we we um we talk about you know in our organization that that healthy health uh healthy community transformation begins with healthy relationships and healthy relationships begin with healthy communication um part of healthy communication is the ability to be able to say that out loud right to say those hard things out loud without uh feeling uh feeling any uh pressure that that that that you're gonna face some sort of ostracizing because you said it you know that you can say it but say it with safety. And I know one of the things that you know in a book that I read years ago Jim Collins Good to Great he talked about confronting the brutal facts right as part of that's what separated you know good organizations that kind of fizzled out over time versus great organizations that reach that uh reach that height and then are able to sustain it is that they confront the brutal facts and he said in that book that um you must confront the brutal facts or the brutal facts will eventually confront you. And I think communities are like that as well that if we just kind of gloss over this stuff and paint rosy pictures in areas that need attention then eventually um eventually the the the the the paint starts to starts to bleed and we and and it starts showing up on our front doors in in harmful ways and shows up uh in in the community in harmful ways and so we we have to be honest about um the things that we see when we see them because that's the only way we can really see healing train uh take place. So I appreciate I appreciate your honesty in sharing that I I really really do. So here's the last question. Man we've talked about a lot of things the church obviously has a role in being a part of the solution as it relates to the children of our community if you had if you had one thing two things maybe that you would encourage the church towards in in in in running in this lane and running in this space how would you encourage the church what what can the church do uh to be a better advocate to uh this this work yeah I'll say a couple of things first of all the easy one is I need advocates I need people in there taking on a kid and and fighting for him um I'll I'll give you an example um I was I have five there were five of us we lived in um inner city Albuquerque and there was a church ministry that picked us up every Sunday um and they picked us up in a bus and they took us to church and they fed us lunch and then they brought us home and um that ministry ministered to five kids whose parents had no desire to take them to church who were um doing drugs who were you know just not living the lifestyle and um myself my sister we both became saved we were both saved during that ministry and a part of that ministry and about 12 years ago my sister found the lady who she and her husband drove the bus and picked us all up and shared with her how different our lives were because those individuals she and her husband took every Sunday gone on a bus and picked up all of the kids in the poor neighborhood in the bad part of town and brought them over to their church and ministered to them and how she now had children who weren't living like that.
SPEAKER_03:I had children that weren't living like that and that we had a strong faith because it had been given to us on a bus singing and going to a church that opened their arms to the dirty stinky you know poor kids from the poor neighborhood um and so that that goes a long way you never know what you're instilling at any given time in a child that they can take with them. As we as I went into foster care that stayed with me there was a foundation laid um and so as I went through dark times I talked to God because I had built a relationship with him when I was young. And so even though I was going through horrible times I had a faith and I knew who to talk to and I knew who was there and who was constant.
SPEAKER_06:And it was because somebody had taken the time to show me that um and so I think that's it doesn't have to be a bus ministry um but it's it's important the other thing I would say is there's a lot of moms dads family members out there trying to raise kids there's no book there's probably lots actually there's lots of books but there's you know no writing there's no perfect perfect book or secret sauce in this yeah exactly and a lot of times when we work with the courts and a family gets put back together they need community you know so if we have a church that comes along and helps fill that food their pantries for one Sunday that's great.
SPEAKER_03:But if they come back and check on them in a month and say hey we just wanted to see if you were okay that mom needs that support too in that family. And so we as we're trying to build advocates and church partners we're trying to build community that'll be left behind once we are done with that family that they'll still have a community they can rely on.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah that's that's a perfect uh perfect opportunity for for churches to on board and so I I appreciate you appreciate you sharing your wisdom and your counsel with us not just in that but just collectively over this entire episode this has been absolutely wonderful. So thank you so much uh Samantha for your time uh thank you for your work thank you for your conviction and passion in this work uh may the Lord add to your number and bless us with many many Many, many more like you. Um, for those of you all, oh for those of you, for those of our listeners who would like to keep up with Casa, how can they do that?
SPEAKER_03:You can visit our website, Casa of Heinz County.org, all spelled out, so a lot of letters. Um you can follow us on social media, on Facebook, Instagram, um, and just get involved. If if you're thinking about being an advocate, not quite sure, just give us a call, we'll talk you through it. Um, if you maybe don't want to be an advocate, but you want to get involved and just help. We have lots of ways for that to happen too. And big one, let me come talk. Let me come talk to congregations, to groups, to organizations, um, trying to spread the word, trying to let people know that we exist and that um they can be a part of the work.
SPEAKER_07:Excellent. Excellent. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for those that are listening. You can always uh follow uh this podcast by going to any podcast app, um, searching on Living Reconciled. Be sure to like and share our episodes. That helps us get the message and the word out, and we would love for you to do that. Um, if you want to learn more about Mission Mississippi, you can always visit missionmississippi.org. Learn about all the work that's taking place, not just uh in Hines County, but all over this state uh in the lane and in the area of reconciliation. We would love for you to partner in that work so you can do so by visiting our website, click on the contact page, and also uh fill out a little form, and that will give us an opportunity to connect with you and share with you a little bit more about what's going on with us. It's been a pleasure to hang out with Samantha on behalf of my good friend, Nettie Winners. I am Brian Crawford signing off saying God bless. Thanks for joining Living Reconciled. If you would like more information on how you can be a part of the ongoing work of helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured, please visit us online at missionmississippi.org or call us at 601-353-6477. Thanks again for listening.
